[MUD-Dev] New Topic: Butthead features

[Matt Chatterley]

On Sun, 3 Aug 1997, Jeff Kesselman wrote:

> >5) He notices that no matter what he kills, steals or annoys, he is unable 
> >   to advance in any measurable way.  To his amazement, he eventually reads
> >   something in the rules about role-playing points which are required to
> >   to for development and must be given by another player of a higher
> >   standing.
> 
> Thsi is an interesting concept.  We've paleyd with simialr ones. My
> question pn this is thsi: Buttheads oragnize.  Very effectively actually.
> Once they have one who been good enough to attain high standing, what keeps
> thsi oen froom bootstrapping up a Butthead hriearchy?

Presumably you would need many players in high standing to raise you up -
and this many idiots getting up there would be unlikely. Its true that
idiots group together and try to 'help' each other out as much as possible
(in some cases), but I wouldn't call it organisation so much - more
organised chaos. ;)
 
> >6) Being far too much trouble, he finds another mud to terrorize.
> 
> Lol.  I assume yo uare beign facitious.  Either that, or youa re expecting
> i think a bit much from your design... but we will see.

It depends. IF there are things about the game our butthead likes, he will
do everything he can to stay (despite perhaps saying otherwise), or try
things such as starting a new character, in hope of gaining some fresh
anonymity. If he isn't particularly attracted to the game after an hour or
so, he may well give up (as will many normal players).
 
> >prevention and aid to the victim can occur.  Often this may be the 
> >"coincidental" arrival of well-armed city guardsmen.
> 
>  A ntoe on this... you indeed have hair trigger gaurdsmaen.. you also jhave
> potential contro llags..

Yes and no. :) Since the slant here is to treat them 'in game' (I divide
it personally - in game responses for in game actions, and out of game
responses for out of game actions, eg spamming).

My guards will respond to reported actions - ie, if you steal from someone
and noone sees you, they won't give a damn. But if a guard (or anyone
else) sees you jump someone in the street, they probably will.
 
> Two guys i know got killed b ya guardsman last nigth ebcause they
> accdientally targetd each other TRYING to click on a pig.. and the
> gaurdsman immediately rushde in swinging his sword.

I think thats probably an example of badly implemented guards.
 
> Problem with bots is.. thye are stupid.  Accdients can cause reactions, and
> if theirt actiosn are preprogrammed, they just becoem another part of the
> system to "beat."  tehb utthead gets as muchb of a kick out of defeatign
> your mechanisms and showing, he thinks, hes smarter then YOU as he does
> showing , he thinks, hes better the other players.

But guards do not all have to be bots - you could have player run, or even
PC guards in some places too. Also, its not too hard to draw out enough
information to provide guards which can't be 'tricked' (at any rate, by
now, you're logging things your idiot does, so all they will do is show
ways in which the system could be improved!).
 
> At least this has been our experience.
> 
> >Gamemasters and many players have the ability to jump into NPCs to
> >perform the appropriate spanking.  The butthead is guaranteed by his
> >very nature to never advance to this level of trust.
> 
> Ah...  human moderation.  Thsi indeed helps with the bot rpoblem, but it
> brignins its own qaundries.. levels of staffing fro instacne, what kind of
> survailance mechanisms do your peoepl have? Do tehy get notified of events
> thropugh out the worls or do teh yhave to be there?
> 
> Oh and i TOTALLY disagree with your next statement. To the butthead, staff
> powers are just the higherst level of "power" he/she will ACTIVELY try to
> con you into giving the to him/her a  freind they can easily manuilpulate.

Not so much that as they will often actively defy you in as many ways as
possible, because you are the representation of "authority"  - at least,
those who indulge in 'out of game' abuses.
 
> I hope your 'trusrt' doe snot extend to unlogge duse of thsoe abilities or
> I guarnatee you you will have prblems dowbn the line.  Rememebr as well,
> that power corrupts...

Which is why I inisist on giving people appropriate tools, rather than
outright "powers" (and treat them asuch - goto on my might might be nearly
identical to any other lpmud, except a little more restricted - but I
don't treat it as a power, or rant about how it shouldn't be used). Giving
trust is also a good way to get it back.

Regards,
	-Matt Chatterley
	http://user.itl.net/~neddy/index.html
"Doublethink means the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's
	mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them." -George Orwell